We’ll soon be rolling out a privacy-preserving telemetry system to customer accounts. Learn how the rollout is going to work, and the steps we’ve taken to protect your privacy.
Nah. Its just a tried and true step of enshitification.
Fingers crossed that bitwarden is already profitable so we still have a good cloud password manager…
Small nuance:
“Later this summer, you’ll see the option to participate in our telemetry system and help improve 1Password. You don’t need to take any action right now, and we won’t collect any usage data without your awareness and consent first. Participation will be optional for Individual and Family plan customers. And at this time, our telemetry system won’t be rolled out to any team or business using 1Password.”
Aka, it’s an opt-in that you can simply not opt-in to and if you don’t nothing changes and then it won’t be used on you.
Also the decision to exempt business and teams makes no business sense. Companies derive the lion’s share of their revenue from enterprise. If a company wants to optimize their product offering, you’d do so with your most desireable, profitable segment in mind. This just seems like a backwards decision.
I think more probably, they’re dogfooding it on the consumer segment and then after they’ve worked out the “oops, we shouldn’t have collected that bit of data” errors, they’ll move to include enterprise. But I’d guess that consumers are the guinea pigs here.
For now. This is step one of enshittification. Step 2 is enabling it for new accounts by default. Step 3 is removing the ability for new accounts to turn it off. Step 4 is defaulting it on for legacy users, and step 5 makes it mandatory for everyone that isn’t paying for something.
And at this time, our telemetry system won’t be rolled out to any team or business using 1Password.
Uhh, what? If it’s opt-in why does it matter if team or business doesn’t have this? Different standards? To go through such lengths to explain this telemetry stuff to convince people, “Oh, no worries, yo! It’s OPT-IN! Trust us!” feels very dirty to me.
Business software has very different requirements. It’s much harder to implement stuff for them without breaking those requirements. Think compliances like (ISO) norms and laws regarding commercial businesses, contracts, or even the software being made to work and be administrated on a whole different scale. You can’t compare really…
While I agree it could go worse from here into a downwards spiral of enshitification, all I meant was that the title is a bit misleading into the other direction; making it sound like they would force telemetry onto users. If they wouldn’t say shit about this option, no one would sign up, even if they wouldn’t mind it. And basically, they’re explaining how they tried to make it as anonymous as possible and that’s it’s opt-in, which would also be a way to go if you legitimatly want to get data for improvement only. If that’s truly what they want, time will tell.
The moment it stops being optional I’m looking for a different password manager right away, I switched more complex and important things for similar reasons. But since my experience with them has been good, I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt for now.
I use vaultwarden because I couldn’t get the premium bitwarden to load on my self hosted bitwarden server, but same thing really. I still pay for premium bitwarden. It’s worth it for such a great product.
Keep calm folks, they’re just not profitable right now. Unlike some of the smaller players with a viable business model, they just need to remain profit-driven until those profits arrive.
In that case, assuming I read you correctly, I have to disagree. Privacy and security companies cannot rely on advertising or telemetry to be profitable; doing so is counter and paradoxical to their standing as a security/privacy company.
Bitwarden seems to be doing just fine. 1Password should be taking cues from them, not advertising revenue
I have gone back and forth on KeePassXC and Bitwarden. I usually do a yearly reset of all my passwords and that is when i do the switch. I’m fine with Bitwarden but permissions to make it easy on Android phone seems excessive. You guys are prompting me to reexamine.
main vault is a full offline database in keepassxc
I’m curious what your config looks like for this. How do you keep your db offline but accessible? Is it a restricted docker container? How do you access it when you’re not at home or on multiple machines (like a laptop)?
Not OP but I have my KeePass file on a locally hosted Nextcloud instance. Synced to multiple computers and phone but the Nextcloud server is only accessible at home LAN.
Passwords are the kind of data that don’t belong in the cloud, in my opinion. Those companies are too juicy targets.
Offline as its not being synchronized into the cloud anywhere; if I need it elsewhere I just copy it manually from main OS. I could use some solution but its not worth efforts to my needs. What I keep in bitwarden is enough for my mobile needs
Dumb question but is there something you don’t like about the mobile keepass database editors? I practise similar vault seperation but I always just create a new temp keepass database for certain situations (work, school, etc) and just backup my main one
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If it really requires explicit and informed consent, then that’s ok.
Nah. Its just a tried and true step of enshitification. Fingers crossed that bitwarden is already profitable so we still have a good cloud password manager…
Small nuance:
“Later this summer, you’ll see the option to participate in our telemetry system and help improve 1Password. You don’t need to take any action right now, and we won’t collect any usage data without your awareness and consent first. Participation will be optional for Individual and Family plan customers. And at this time, our telemetry system won’t be rolled out to any team or business using 1Password.”
Aka, it’s an opt-in that you can simply not opt-in to and if you don’t nothing changes and then it won’t be used on you.
Also the decision to exempt business and teams makes no business sense. Companies derive the lion’s share of their revenue from enterprise. If a company wants to optimize their product offering, you’d do so with your most desireable, profitable segment in mind. This just seems like a backwards decision.
I think more probably, they’re dogfooding it on the consumer segment and then after they’ve worked out the “oops, we shouldn’t have collected that bit of data” errors, they’ll move to include enterprise. But I’d guess that consumers are the guinea pigs here.
For now. This is step one of enshittification. Step 2 is enabling it for new accounts by default. Step 3 is removing the ability for new accounts to turn it off. Step 4 is defaulting it on for legacy users, and step 5 makes it mandatory for everyone that isn’t paying for something.
Says them, I guess. Feels kinda weird to me.
Uhh, what? If it’s opt-in why does it matter if team or business doesn’t have this? Different standards? To go through such lengths to explain this telemetry stuff to convince people, “Oh, no worries, yo! It’s OPT-IN! Trust us!” feels very dirty to me.
Business software has very different requirements. It’s much harder to implement stuff for them without breaking those requirements. Think compliances like (ISO) norms and laws regarding commercial businesses, contracts, or even the software being made to work and be administrated on a whole different scale. You can’t compare really…
While I agree it could go worse from here into a downwards spiral of enshitification, all I meant was that the title is a bit misleading into the other direction; making it sound like they would force telemetry onto users. If they wouldn’t say shit about this option, no one would sign up, even if they wouldn’t mind it. And basically, they’re explaining how they tried to make it as anonymous as possible and that’s it’s opt-in, which would also be a way to go if you legitimatly want to get data for improvement only. If that’s truly what they want, time will tell.
The moment it stops being optional I’m looking for a different password manager right away, I switched more complex and important things for similar reasons. But since my experience with them has been good, I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt for now.
It’s good to have Bitwarden
I use vaultwarden because I couldn’t get the premium bitwarden to load on my self hosted bitwarden server, but same thing really. I still pay for premium bitwarden. It’s worth it for such a great product.
Keep calm folks, they’re just not profitable right now. Unlike some of the smaller players with a viable business model, they just need to remain profit-driven until those profits arrive.
Genuinely cannot tell if you are sarcastic or not.
By default one should assume everything I utter is sarcastic…except this sentence; this is real real.
In that case, assuming I read you correctly, I have to disagree. Privacy and security companies cannot rely on advertising or telemetry to be profitable; doing so is counter and paradoxical to their standing as a security/privacy company.
Bitwarden seems to be doing just fine. 1Password should be taking cues from them, not advertising revenue
So, the Spez excuse?
Say whatever you like but “a privacy-preserving telemetry” sounds to me like an oxymoron.
Im using bitwarden for mobile devices filled with crucial credentials and my main vault is a full offline database in keepassxc
Why don’t you use a sync tool to automatically sync your KeePass database when you’re home and just get rid of Bitwarden?
Edit: Or just use Syncthing to always keep your database on all devices in sync. You wouldn’t even need to open ports.
I have gone back and forth on KeePassXC and Bitwarden. I usually do a yearly reset of all my passwords and that is when i do the switch. I’m fine with Bitwarden but permissions to make it easy on Android phone seems excessive. You guys are prompting me to reexamine.
Anyone try self-hosting VaultWarden?
Yes, I have a self hosted instance of Vaultwarden and I’m very happy with it.
I’m curious what your config looks like for this. How do you keep your db offline but accessible? Is it a restricted docker container? How do you access it when you’re not at home or on multiple machines (like a laptop)?
Not OP but I have my KeePass file on a locally hosted Nextcloud instance. Synced to multiple computers and phone but the Nextcloud server is only accessible at home LAN.
Passwords are the kind of data that don’t belong in the cloud, in my opinion. Those companies are too juicy targets.
I host vaultwarden, but it’s behind a tailscale network. Best of both worlds.
That’s the neat part… he doesn’t.
Offline as its not being synchronized into the cloud anywhere; if I need it elsewhere I just copy it manually from main OS. I could use some solution but its not worth efforts to my needs. What I keep in bitwarden is enough for my mobile needs
Dumb question but is there something you don’t like about the mobile keepass database editors? I practise similar vault seperation but I always just create a new temp keepass database for certain situations (work, school, etc) and just backup my main one